CardPlayer Stealing From PokerNews

[Jeremy]

Well I suppose since this story is finding its way around the rest of the internet, I mine as well post it here. And mind you, much of the other chatter going on from people in the various forums are strictly poker players and do not realize the business implications here. Nor do they realize what was involved with PokerNews gaining the exclusive rights, I do.

Whether you think it's bullshit or not that one company get the exclusive coverage rights or not, that is not the issue. That is a decision from Harrah's and at the end of the day it all comes down to money. Furthermore, obtaining the exclusive rights to cover the WSOP was not a hand out to PokerNews. It involved several months of negotiations and hundreds of thousands of dollars before the event even got started.

As we speak, PokerNews.com is paying over 40 people to work the WSOP full-time and give live reporting better than any other company has ever done. We have invested a tremendous amount of money just on the technology to be able to report this. Furthermore, we have contracts in place that are there to ensure us our investment was a solid investment.

I can honestly say that this is a disappointment to the industry that a company as big as CardPlayer would stoop to this level. I am not sure if I should be mad at them, or embarrassed for them.

Here is the post Tony made in his blog today regarding CardPlayer Stealing from PokerNews.

[kaus]

Just curious but is PN the only site allowed to do the live coverage and chips? Or is it simply the chip count that belongs to them?

[Jeremy]

Live Updates and Chip Counts. We are the only media staff allowed in the Rio room for this purpose.

[AceHigh Pino]

In either case, what CardPlayer is doing seems pretty unethical and very immoral. The Shulman's and CardPlayer itself are (as Jeremy mentioned) probably hiding behind a legal fence that allows them to somewhat get away with it since it is published digital media -- but just because it's there doesn't mean it should be utilized for their own advantage. There are big bucks being paid by PN to cover this, and that should be honored by even the biggest of competitors.

[SuperAffiliate]

This is crazy, especially considering how much money & effort the PokerNews staff must have put into this project.

Last time they had an Aussie coverage which worked fine. So far this WSOP coverage has been excellent.

With that said, they deserve to have the exclusive rights for WSOP live reporting.

[Jeremy]

Haha, now this is funny............thanks Wicked Chops. Seems as if this is no longer a quiet issue just being chatted about amongst a few in the industry.

[kaus]

The members are chatting in the forums now...many are questioning Cardplayer (including their own!)and alot of them don't even get what the big deal is. Surely all the blogs etc writing about this will open some eyes. CAn't wait to hear what CP's response will be.

[PartyForFree]

I'm suprised this is such a big deal. Honestly...I am.

Had they stolen the content of updates with commentary, I would see that as something very different.

I, personally, look at the chip counts as scores. Would I need express consent from NFL to post updated scores of the Dolphins game on my site? Unlikely...

I don't think you could argue that chip counts are intellictual property. Once they're in the public domain, I think they become fair game to repeat.

Let's say NBC pays a ton of money for exclusive tv coverage of the olympics. Is that going to stop ABC from providing up to date standings on the medal count? No way.

[Jeremy]

No offense dude, but I can see why you wouldn't understand considering your entire website is a direct copy of partypoker.com.

Let's say NBC pays a ton of money for exclusive tv coverage of the olympics. Is that going to stop ABC from providing up to date standings on the medal count? No way

Yes it probably will, I don't think I ever remember seeing other up to the minute updates on the superbowl, world series, NBA Finals, or the olympics.

No major corporation would be that dumb to shoot themselves in the foot. Negotiated deals like this are about business, money, and ethics. Not about who can copy/paste their competitions information the quickest.


The post below from 2+2 sums things up very well.

Quote:

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can you imagine MLB telling ESPN they can't cover baseball anymore b/c MLB sold the rights to report the scores to Fox? Harrah's blows.

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Can you imagine an ESPN reporter giving you his observation of the game in front of a green screen and having the backdrop become the ball field? The reporter in this hypothetical is not there at the game, but says that he/she is. Is that ethical?

Companies pay a fee to deliver stats from the game to outlets that can't afford (or chose not to afford) reporters to cover those games. All the highlights on ESPN are paid for through agreements with other news organizations (that is why you see the "Courtesy Of" screen listing all the organizations that were the original source of the information that ESPN chooses to retransmit on Sports Center). That is why MLB has a speech that the commentators read around the third inning or so saying "The rebroadcast or retransmission of the events, descriptions, or accounts of this game..." are used. 3rd party companies devise a system so that the stats are reported to the news outets that can't cover the games. These 3rd party companies pay a fee to MLB to complete this task.

Those that publish highlights on YouTube of their favorite events (including poker) are technically breaking copyright law (if the companies choose to enforce it).

Harrah's has every right to control the stats that comes out of their facility since it is being coverend like a media event. If Cardplayer had people covering the event, then Tony G has no claim. Since he asserts that they are not, and that they are just ripping the results for free from him, it is indeed unethical.

I worked in the Sports Industry as a PA announcer for a minor league baseball club. We would get calls from a third party stats company from the 7th inning onward that would deliver information to the wires and outlets. We only had two reporters from the local papers covering the event, but the box scores would appear in the other minor league markets.

Tony G has a right to be angry...I don't like his behavior at the poker table, but his account of Cardplayer stealing from him is indeed accurate.

Yeah...too long for NVG...mea culpa...

[kaus]

Besides the obvious implications by Poker News, couldn't Harrah's also get involved with CardPlayer for doing this?

I sure hope it was worth it for them!